Barack Obama has made us a lawless nation. He is, by far, the worst president we’ve ever had.

Barack Obama is a madman.

So proud to be an American – NOT

this is not being “American”, this is being “Criminal”

No, not true. Your man Bush is the gentleman who fits all of those comments. Obama merely has the distinction of being too much of a wussy to do anything about it.

2nd worst. You know damn well it all started under Bush.

Ya your right …. but has anyone been brought up on war crimes charges?

Crime ignored is crime encouraged.

It’s more than that. Obama IS a war criminal because he is REQUIRED to prosecute.

And we just keep sinking deeper and deeper into the cesspool. Better start Hoarding History books before they start getting rewritten. There is entirely waaayyyy to many honorable things in our old history books that won’t jive with what has happened in the last 10 years.

Ask a kid today what they thinks about their country. If you are over 40 you will be ashamed to hear what they believe about their own country.

You are 100% right, being one country’s national or another’s makes no difference. It is the persons involved. However I think Obama has proved to be worse than the two BUSHES!

“…instead President Obama has decided to write the next sad, pathetic chapter in the book of the military commissions,”

Sure, there’s a world of difference between Bush and Obama; that is, if your world is the size of an amoeba.

Aiding and Abetting is a crime of complicity.

Nope, Obama is #1. Under Bush, only Republicans supported fascism. Under Obama both Republicans and Democrats support fascism. Obama is roughly twice as bad as Bush. It’s quantifiable.

Nope. Obama has embraced all of Bush’s crimes and added his own. This is not my opinion; this stuff is demonstrable. Think for yourself.

You raise a good point. But is that Obama’s fault or the fault of those who don’t care as long as the one in office has a “D” after their name?

ugh. no chance left for elightenment?

ugh. no chance left for elightenment?

Well, I’m asking liberals to vote for anybody but Obama. In the case of Obama, the “D” stands for Dick the Second.

Agreed. And under the Geneva Convention, he is required to prosecute or he’s one of ‘em as well.

I agree. He needs a challenger.

I forgot – rendition also started under Clinton.

ass rape torture!…i guess they didn’t cover that one at the Geneva convention…

American Justice? I expected this from Bush but from a Constitutional lawyer?

The US is obviously a third world fascist police state.

We have become what we feared most. Shameful.

Coerced confessions can be introduced into evidence? When do we get to question Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld a & Rice?

Greetings,

What are these “honorable” things that you speak of??? Is it the part of the Constitution where a slaves is 3/5th of a human? Maybe it is the forced removal and genocide of the Native Americans that lived here before the Europeans arrived? Perhaps you are referring to the War with Mexico where we snatched the entire Southwest from Mexico? The war with Spain was sure honorable wasn’t it. Here is an honorable quote from General Smith who was in the Philippines, “I want no prisoners. I wish you to kill and burn, the more you kill and burn the better it will please me. I want all persons killed who are capable of bearing arms in actual hostilities against the United States.” He ordered all males over the age of 9 butchered. Better make sure that is in your special history book.

Dropping Atomic Bombs on Japanese Civilians was pretty honorable. Maybe the Firebombing of Dresden was what you were referring too? No? Maybe we should go closer to home and look at the Jim Crow laws here in the US? You couldn’t contain all the honor in that.

Damn, are you ashamed to hear what I have to say? Good.

Let’s stop, and just take a look at what the judge ruled: not that a confession coerced by the threat of rape is admissible; the question presented was whether a subsequent confession, not directly linked to the threat, is admissible. These are different questions. The answer are not unrelated, and there is a long body of law discussing when and how a “taint” of a piece of evidence can be removed by subsequent events. I am not arguing that the decision was correct (or not), but it is not the decision described in the headline, in the most of article, and the bulk of the posts.

I’m glad the military has years of pride to shield itself from this obvious sham

No time soon… not while pretzels are better at holding America’s war criminals to account than the current administration.

This disgusts me. I could get Cheney to squeal like a little girl using the same techniques.

Good point. Usually in criminal court any subsequent confession would be tainted due to the original coercion, but this is military court, which doesn’t adhere to all the same points as civilian courts. Not saying whether this decision is right or wrong, especially since I’m Canadian, but it seems like the issue at hand is presented from a civilian law stand point, and not enough background on military precedent is provided to make a solid call for most people.

And what makes you think that the history books we were taught from weren’t the result of someone in our country’s past rewriting history? When I started doing my own research on various subjects (and people) from our country’s past, I came to realize that there were very good reasons to question EVERYTHING I had been taught to believe was true about our nation’s past. Were the people we were taught to believe were “heroes,” really heroes? And were those we were taught to believe were the “bad guys,” really the bad guys? (Recall, cheney making the statement that bush would go down in history as one of our nation’s greatest presidents. At the time he said that, I cynically thought to myself, yeah, because you plan on writing it that way–not because there’s any truth to it.)

That old war criminal henry kissinger said (paraphrasing), it’s not the truth that’s important; it’s what people BELIEVE is true that matters.

The Canadian perspective
I’m from Canada, eh. I was just sitting cross-legged in front of my igloo on an ice floe enjoying my poutine and Canadian bacon and a six pack of really strong beer with my nine huskies when some smoke signals over the horizon broadcast this story.
It said that terrorists from a rogue state kidnapped Canadian citizen Kadr in Afghanistan when he was a child based on hearsay evidence, held him hostage well into his adult years without charges while torturing and abusing him and repeatedly threatening him with rape and murder, forcibly extracting “confessions out of. I tell you, these terrorists pose a serious threat.
Now they are trying him in a secret kangaroo court run by military mullahs.
The Grand Mullah has promised that a conviction is “virtually certain”. Grand Mullahs know secret shit about secret laws that us Canadians don’t, I guess.

Do we need anymore evidence that these are kangaroo courts? The military judge and the members of the court know their future promotions are riding on a guilty verdict. What a hideous
stain on the officer corps which contends that integrity is their highest value. And, I say this
after many years of active duty. Simply disgusting and shameful.

american justice = oxymoron

Wow.. I was sure this article was referring to some horrible court in Iran or North Korea… but an American judge? Really? What sort of justice relies on testimony or confessions gained through torture? Isn’t that what the Spanish Inquisition did? Isn’t that how they determined if someone was a witch??? Very disturbing. Evil.

Smart ruling! Because there is no better way to ensure that an adolescent boy tells the truth than to threaten him with being “raped to death.” Once you’ve got his attention with that, all you need to do is tell him exactly what he’s guilty of.

Gosh, it’s wonderful being an American!

Wow, simply wow. They ae allowing a confession from a minor no less to be used in court under the threat of being raped to death. And then we are holding trials that had people tortured for their confession which under the Neuremberg trials would be war crimes (I guess they owe the German officers an apology). We are killing ourselves and we don’t even know it. I feel sorry for the US, because I see a future that will turn this country into a third world cess pool. When we finally go down, their won’t be any person to help us up. Just like the big bad bully who gets beat up finally and once down finds out even his friends won’t help him. We’ve bullied and cajolled and threatened people around this planet for decades, and they are tired of it.

Two thoughts!
1. You’re no liberal. You’re a republican’t troglodyte trolling liberal sites to instigate dissension. Fuck-off!
2. You’re entitled to your opinion, but not your ownset of facts. All you have is opinion masquerading as fact. Fuck-off!
.

You’re so messed up in the head that you interpret Obama’s secrecy, torture, and murder as liberalism. That’s the fact. Ask yourself why. Ask yourself why you allowed Barack Obama to make a simpleton fascist of you.

Not really. Go to law school before rendering an opinion on law!

If you are expressing a political opinion …
“The PEOPLE should require the President to prosecute war crimes.” I would then be in agreement with you.
.

You & capers have a real problem with facts. You need to stay over on your teabeggar sites whar yore apreshated.

If I had to choose between you and rand paul on the craziness scale – you would probably win. He’s merely a psychotic liar who does this for political gain.

You do it because you just don’t know any better.

Write when you get work — I figure that means we won’t hear from you again, unless you move to India or China.

Yep all true liberals love raping kids. Your an asshole.

Potty mouth ain’t you?

911

I thought that we were returning to the international community as a law abiding nation because we elected a Constitutional Law Professor.

I was dangged wrong huh?

re your dislike of Bush – yes, I recalled that after clicking post, which is why I went back and removed the “Your man Bush” part of the comment.

But the idea that Bush can be the one who implements all of these policies but somehow it’s Obama who is the madman, and the worst president ever for continuing them is silly. Obama is a better President than that Crawford idiot. He is to be condemned for continuing the policies started under Bush, but he did not implement them, and the blame should fall where it belongs. If you can’t see that, then you have some personal dislike for Obama that is clouding the obvious.

We might disagree on a few things, but on this we agree- Obama no longer has my vote.

That’s because more truthful history is available to today’s kids. Some kids have read Howard Zinn and Noam Chomsky. They’re not getting the traditional, “history written by the victors” version of American history that the wingnuts love so much (when they’re not rewriting it).

I’ll go out on a limb here and say that when a teenager’s been shot, tortured and threatened with rape and murder, all of his subsequent confessions have been tainted by coercion. In any civilized court these “confessions” would be thrown out as useless and inadmissable. Sadly, Obama and the US military aren’t civilized.

You’ve been trained to scream “Lie!” when faced with the truth. Ask yourself why.

Republicans have been evil for a very long time. It took Obama to bring out the evil in you. That’s what makes him the worst president in the history of this country.

You get my vote for comment of the year (so far).

Actually, “extraordinary rendition” started under Reagan, but it was expanded under Clinton. Interestingly, it’s been reported that it made Clinton uncomfortable, but it was Al Gore who told Clinton that it was a no-brainer.
Yup.

Not only is the fruit of a poisoned tree, the whole goddamned garden reeks of toxins.

No, an American military judge. In case you didn’t notice, we have been a military dictatorship since Nov. 22, 1963.

Yep. We nearly got a death penalty on that one.

Butchers like Columbus and Andrew Jackson?

Do you know about the phrase “separation of powers”? He’s president, not king.

I’m reminded of a Nietzsche quote regarding the perils of staring into the abyss…but I’m actually too disgusted to look up the exact words right now. This is one of those facepalm, call-it-a-day, go to bed and deal with the world tomorrow moments. Good night America…it was nice knowing you while you lasted.

I’m reminded of a Nietzsche quote regarding the perils of staring into the abyss…but I’m actually too disgusted to look up the exact words right now. This is one of those facepalm, call-it-a-day, go to bed and deal with the world tomorrow moments. Good night America…it was nice knowing you while you lasted.

China and Russia, can you please launch your collective nuclear arsenals at the United States now?

There, fixed that for you.

Officially. Today. You have to be asleep or a moron to be an apologist. Which is it?

When you look outside you don’t SEE police state. But.
When you read that someone had to actually RULE on this atrocity. . . well, what do you even say to that.? Stasi fucks.

And you’re close to illiterate, and certainly ill-tempered, ill-mannered and, according to the next comment down the page, ill-prepared to deal with intellectual discourse.

You, capers and a couple more here are republican’t trogs spreading your racial crap instead of discussing the issue. The judge wasn’t appointed by O’Bama.

AG Holder’s Justice Dept. and O’BAma’s political team wish to treat the terrorists as criminals, not elevate their misbehavior to combatant status. To do so at this time is to ensure another one and done Democratic President.

This said; two questions demand answers! Who do you want to replace O’Bama? The answer must be realistic or we’ll get a republican’t that will be worse than shrub. The second is: why do you feel liberals are so stupid as to take you seriously? Go back to your rush limbo worshipping site; kiss o’reilly’s tushy, and lick hannity’s tooku clean. No one around here is going to give what you have to say traction; you have no bottom.

Eschelon began in the early 50′s. Last I checked Clinton was in Grammar School and Eisenhower’s Dulles brothers did the deed. Pretty good project, along with Corona, kept us ahead of the Sovs for about 40 odd years – long enough for them to implode, as all autocratic systems are that become too large.

That’s why the republican’ts want small government and anarchy. Small government can be controled if it’s a dictaorship and anarchy just makes it all that more easy to control the government.

You are both mistaken. The project is named Echelon, not ‘Eschelon’ and it was formally started under the banner of the UKUSA treaty in 1947, not in “the early 50′s”. And for God’s sake no, it wasn’t started under Clinton, but neither was it started by the Dulles brothers. (Don’t bother looking it up in Wikipedia, I quote directly from the books on the matter which Wikipedia cites incorrectly)

Far from “protecting” the United States from nuclear attack, the network’s primary goal evolved into a spy ring of Western countries, spying on each others citizens to avoid liability under national legislation; protective legislation which, since has been obliterated so that the voyeuristic crimes are officially legal; and abusing eavesdropping for corporate espionage.

And last, but not least: republicans don’t want small government. Unless you want to quote me some statistics that spending under Bush, as well as the amount of people working for or contracted out by the government, have declined.

Otherwise, I suggest with emphasis that you keep your offensive revisionist lies and fabrications to yourself. Or to give them a proper place in the fiction department of the local library.

Long as we prosecute Rangel and Waters, we’ve cleaned our house. This must be legal, present and all previous.

America should do fare justice
http://www.worldnewsnetworks.blogspot.com

http://www.worldnewsnetworks.blogspot.com
america should do fair justice

Throwing a grenade in a war is… part of war. How did he commit a crime that he can be tried for?

=== popurls.com === popular today…

yeah! this story has entered the popular today section on popurls.com…

I am sickened by this.

That’s not change! That’s more of the same!

A large percentage of Canadians actually prefer to let him rot where he is. His father moved his family to Canada just to get protection of a strong left wing sentiment to save his ass while he then went on to terrorism in other countries. Canada had to “rescue” his father once from the clutches of a “foreign” government who imprisoned his due to a terror plot. The father was killed fighting alliance forces, and his older brother was paralyzed in the firefight. Now in Canada we have to pay for all his medical treatment that he received while fighting against Canadians. Even if Khadr was not guilty of throwing the grenade, the fact is he went to fight against the very country he is now trying to seek to protect his sorry hide. Please, keep him. And while you are at it, can you also take the rest of his family, who are currently living under the protection of the Canadian government, getting much money from our government, all the while spewing on about how bad this country is …..

My fellow Americans welcome to the 2010 incarnation of Orwell’s 1984 where anyone guilty of thoughtcrime may be denounced and taken to the cellars of the Ministry of Love to be tortured. This judge should be impeached and indicted for treason tried and upon conviction imprisoned for a minimum of 5 years.

it must be hell living in guantanamo.

it must be hell living in guantanamo.

because he’s a fucking moron.

Asshole.

Your no liberal so shut the fuck up.

Most supported segregation as well.

You see once we invade a country they become insurgents wherebye it becomes illegal to attack us while they are fair game.

Not to nitpick, but the US did not firebomb Dresden.

This fits in quite well with another story from Iran today, in which a woman who was initially condemned to death by stoning gave a supposed confession on Iranian TV, supposedly admitting that she was complicit in the alleged murder of her husband.

Threats of death by stoning and death by gang-rape seem roughly equivalent. If our government and the government of Iran agree on this, why not on other laws and practices as well? We could write threats of stoning into our official interrogation procedures, while they could institutionalize the use of rape as a persuader in tough cases of adultery.

Oh, they already do use rape in that context? Well, that just shows how much our judicial system has to learn before it’s as advanced as the one in Iran!

Everything you write about the defendant could be true. I have no idea. Nevertheless, this rape-threat-is-ok ruling is still a judicial catastrophe, creating case law that will apply to all future “detainees” of the U.S. What this means is that threatening teenagers with death by rape now becomes a perfectly legal procedure, an accepted tool in our interrogators bag of tricks.

If this ruling stands, it becomes impossible to distinguish between the U.S. and the worst regimes in history in respect to torture of prisoners.

Wonder how the judge would render the sentence should he be threatened with rape for not dismissing the case- since he doesn’t bother to apply standards of justice anyway…

Canuck101:

Don’t for a second think that your blather represents the sentiments of a “large percentage of Canadians”. You are a bigot, and likely an American trying to create some sort of ill-conceived argument for not “socializing” medicine.

I do not support/condone/excuse terrorism, but I do believe in basic human rights and decency – things that guantanamo prisoners are denied daily. Take your Stephen Harper-supporting, white-bread, bigoted ass home and don’t ever pretend you speak for me and my country again.

“You can judge a society by how they treat their weakest members.” – Mahatma Ghandi

You should take your head out of your ass before typing – http://washingtonindependent.com/26162/obama-may-be-required-to-prosecute-bush-officials-for-war-crimes

Obamabot are you? Expand your horizons, dipshit.

George Bush must be so proud of his successor, the hopey, changey Barry Obama.

Thanks for the additional info.

That was so well put.

So, you call someone a bigot and then in the same breath make a bigoted statement about Americans? Don’t for a second think his or anyone else’s sentiments represent all Americans.

Um, yes we did. The US and British both bombed the city even though Russian soldiers were just outside of the city. It was done to intimidate the Russians so they could see the power of our air force. The city was packed with refugees fleeing the Red army and estimates run as high as 250,000 deaths caused by the bombing.

The bombing had no real military objective.

America now accepts confessions coerced through the threat of rape (to death? wtf…) of a fifteen year old…

We Have Met The Enemy and He Is Us.

Those estimates are now universally held to be very inflated. The actual casualties were around 1/10th of that. The US did drop incendiary bombs in their daytime raids, but it was the British night raid on Feb 14th 1944 that ignited the infamous firestorm. It is also worth noting that there were numerous legitimate military targets in the city. Saying the purpose of the raid was to intimidate the USSR is speculation at best.

I am not trying to defend the decision to use mass incendiary bombing, just trying to clarify the facts.

So, you’re saying the person that started a gang-rape is the bad buy, but those that pile on after.. not so much?

I don’t get your logic.

anarchy, by definition, means no one is in control of anything. You have to be insane to think anarchy is better than ordered society because anarchy is more dangerous to yourself as well. People who’s brains don’t work right don’t care if they are at mortal risk, they just want to fulfill hedons at all costs. Sane, rational people have long term vision and stability in mind, and it’s what built the modern world.

And Republicans hardly want “small government”, they want “no oversight of corporations” and “tyrannical control over the public” while failing to provide any meaningful value to the public. Actually, using the term “Republican” is as nonsensical as using the term “Democrat” these days. The parties no longer represent any specific ideology, they are fronts used to trick people into voting for right-winger who want tyrannical control to build up their corporate empires.

anarchy, by definition, means no one is in control of anything. You have to be insane to think anarchy is better than ordered society because anarchy is more dangerous to yourself as well. People who’s brains don’t work right don’t care if they are at mortal risk, they just want to fulfill hedons at all costs. Sane, rational people have long term vision and stability in mind, and it’s what built the modern world.

And Republicans hardly want “small government”, they want “no oversight of corporations” and “tyrannical control over the public” while failing to provide any meaningful value to the public. Actually, using the term “Republican” is as nonsensical as using the term “Democrat” these days. The parties no longer represent any specific ideology, they are fronts used to trick people into voting for right-winger who want tyrannical control to build up their corporate empires.

Many of these things are in place by Presidential Decree, which puts them directly under his control. His military is directly under his control, and it was SOLDIERS doing a lot of the torturing. That under his control. Keeping troops in Iraq is directly under his control. Keeping Gitmo open is directly under his control.

Oh, I’m Canadian and love it. I have disagreed with many instances of the government non involvement such as the Arar case. What I cannot condone is using our tax dollars trying to defend a person and family who hate Canada and actively promoting the destruction of our country. Try reading this

http://www.danielpipes.org/1639/the-khadrs-canadas-first-family-of-terrorism

And then explain to all of us why you think this family (other than one notable who I greatly admire for the stand he took) deserves our protection, our money, and our sympathy.

Greetings,

Yes, the United States government will tell you that those numbers are inflated and that Dresden was a military target but that simply isn’t true. First, there were factories 60 miles outside of Dresden but they were not targeted – only the civilian center of the city was targeted. Also, the bombings were timed in such a way as to kill as many rescue workers as possible.

2nd, the largest exodus in human history was taking place as millions were fleeing the Red Army which was very busy giving the Germans payback for all the atrocities committed on the Eastern Front.

Dresden had, by many estimates, 600,000 refugees when it was attacked. Since the city had no real military significance, the Germans did not have so much as a single fighter squadron to protect it. The allies could bomb this city without too much worry. As a matter of fact, fighter escorts left the bombers and strafed vehicles on the roads leading in to Dresden to further delay search and rescue that could arrive from outside of the city.

More than 700.000 phosphorus bombs were dropped on 1.2 million people. One firebomb for every 2 people. This was a terrible War Crime that should have been punished. One that the United States would like you to forget.

“The detonation shook the cellar walls. The sound of the explosions mingled with a new, stranger sound which seemed to come closer and closer, the sound of a thundering waterfall; it was the sound of the mighty tornado howling in the inner city.”

“Others hiding below ground died. But they died painlessly–they simply glowed bright orange and blue in the darkness. As the heat intensified, they either disintegrated into cinders or melted into a thick liquid–often three or four feet deep in spots.”

- A POW in Dresden

Amen to that, Brother.

http://bit.ly/WLdr3d

see top of site for updates

-dcm

He hasn’t put down the instruments of executive authoritarianism. He is Mr. Obama. Not Mr. President. See http://bit.ly/MrObam for my rationale.

-dcm

Hey LumberJock. In this “legal” environment, of what use are Law Schools?

http://thewall.civiblog.org/rsf/nsa.html
http://bit.ly/dr3d

What, LumberJock, would You have the “PEOPLE” do? Shall we adopt the same tactics to reform and obtain redress for our grievances from our President as Mr. Obama has taken up? Shall we kill him? Shall we extraordinarily render (kidnap) him? Shall we apply “enhanced interrogation” techniques, torture him?

Tell me about what the hell YOU know about “law school”, sir. And what techniques You recommend to require the president to prosecute war crimes. Or abide by his Oath of Office.

Be careful how You answer me, LumberJock. I’m a Veteran. I take Oaths seriously.

-dcm

What he said.

My oh my, LumberJock. How erudite a response. I’ll bet You sure know how to sweep a girl off her feet!

This guy’s obviously a troll.

I’d ignore him at this point.

Canuck101 comments that Khadr “should rot where he is.” In arguing with another commenter here, he provided a link for his good information to Daniel Pipes, a notorious Jewish-American hater of all Arabs and Muslims. Daniel Pipes, ultra Jewish-Zionist who was nominated by George Bush to be on the U.S. Institute for Peace. He is so bad that following my complaint to my right-wing Senator and die-hard supporter of Israel, the Senator wrote back saying he had receivedi nformation which concerned him about Pipes and he would “watch” him before making a decision. Bush appointed Pipes during a Congressional recess, but he didn’t pass the smell test and was subsequently removed as a member.

He’s lucky he was just threatened.

In Okinawa, a whole lotta little girls have been gang raped near to death by American soldiers and marines.

Peace

Well obviously, those girls must have been insurgents. Or each soldier felt threatened and felt he had to defend himself.

The percentage of Canadians you are referring too is the racist and bigoted one, you hate all the ethnic or naturalized “canadians” as well as the natives. The fact that Harper has been kept as Prime Minister by the colonial ruler tells me you are in the majority. Many claim that it is the true Canadian tradition and that multiculturalism under Prime Minister Trudeau were anomaly.

DISGRAZIA!

There are still good guys in the US military , Bradley Manning and Ethan McCord are two that spring to mind . There’s a couple of real American hero’s.

Coerced ‘confession’ from a child, why not? In fact, lets not even bother with trials. Lets just put a bullet in him and be done with it. For all the money, time and effort involved in this, you’d think the kid was the son of satan. Its a good thing that the Allies didn’t bring every captured German soldier to trial, it would have bankrupted the country. Oh wait, the Germans are white Christians…when they were killing Americans, they probably didn’t mean it.

Another show of support from Obama for the Military Industrial Complex, and a heinous implied admission that the Geneva Conventions are no longer relevant to the United States’ military operations. I hope that the “professional left” takes this piece of news and runs it all over the nation. It’s an example of the essential Obama: soaring rhetoric with Bush-like actions. In terms of policy, Obama is far to the right of Dwight Eisenhower with his piss-ant health care bill and his laughable financial reform and his vacuous DOJ, to name a few.

Next on the agenda: justice by tossing the defendant off a cliff, witch-hunting style. Why bother with tribunals? Let’s have live TV coverage of the “Cliff Toss”. It’ll make millions for FoxNews. If the defendant survives, he’s guilty. Simple as that. Great TV. Eric Holder will be on vacation.

Next on the agenda: justice by tossing the defendant off a cliff, witch-hunting style. Why bother with tribunals? Let’s have live TV coverage of the “Cliff Toss”. It’ll make millions for FoxNews. If the defendant survives, he’s guilty. Simple as that. Great TV. Eric Holder will be on vacation.

Why should we believe everything that the US government says about this kid or this case.
Can you really trust what this or any Government says anymore ?
There track record on lies and cover ups should speak volumes here.
What if this was you or your kid or someone in your family ?
We have no idea what the hell happened over there or why this kid and his father were where the army says they were.
All i know is that you can’t trust anything the Government says anymore.

And Gibbs wonders why we progressives are fed up with Obama, or should I start calling him Bush-dark?

Well you wouldn’t want anybody to get the idea that what’s been going on for the last 9 years has been wrong or anything, would ya?

If he couldn’t take a little threat, he shouldn’t have flown that jet into them buildings, should he?

Torture is torture and this is especially horrible. To do this to a child or even an adult is totally against everything the U.S. is supposed to stand for. Shame, Shame!!!!!!!!!!!

If he had actually flown the plane into one of the buildings do you think he would actually be alive… It’s time to actually use your brains people!

This is how degenerate the American judiciary and by direct extension the American establishment has become.

And they still have the effrontery to regard themselves as leaders of the free world.

They are not even members of it.

Am I stil supposed to respect Anmerica?

Give me a good reason to!!

Gore Vidal said it all. Americans as a rule have no knowlege of history. They don’t know what magna carta is, what habeas corpus is, or even what the rule of law is. They are ignorant.

I have a good knowkledge of world history, and I see America rushing to commit the same old errors that the Enlightenment sought to overcome, like admitting confessions taken from torture.

when a civilization forgets it becomes, as in this instance, the United States of Amnesia, as Gore Vidal said (it is his term); and when it forgets civilization itself it becomes a barbarous despotism

Google Gore Vidal on youtube. He said it all

THere is an ad at the side column, to be in to win a green card answer this question.

PULEEEZE!!! Dont make me laugh so much. A sckier joke I have not heard.

american fascism as shown by its establishment if not its people is such that i would be OUT OF MY MIND to visit such a country as that.

Back to topic:

American arrogance dos not care that it is building a tidal wave of pure hatred against itself, just as the Assyrians did when the whole ancient world lined up to destroy it in 612 BC. (I TOLD you I know my world history)

But Americans SHOULD care when its own natural allies, people like me, white, anglosaxon protestant etc become so incensed by american trampling on everything I and others like me hold dear, that we, america’s natural allies now hold that country in contempt.

Does America think we will help it when it befouls everything it claimed to stand for?

Yes, indeed, but I grow to think they are the exception that proves the rule

I suppose we should just let him go????????

As easily done as said!

Well dicky-bird, I’m a vet too. And a law school graduate. As well as Staff College at Leavenworth and War College at Carlisle & an instructor at both.

When raising a closed hand, be prepared to call the next raise.

Pardon my misspelling. I lacked attention to detail there. The concept may date back to May >> October period of ’47 … but it took Allen & Foster Dulles to get it off the shelf. How it was misdirected by nixon & reagan is irrelevant.

If you aren’t known to others in the program, identify your conclusions as opinion, not fact!

The discussion is of advocacy. repubilican[ts advocate small government so they can deliver a monarchy or despotic dictatorship.

Dictaorships deliver union busting and corporate imunity. Look at China!

Jesse Ventura told Larry King that given a waterboard and Dick Cheney, he would have him confess t the Sharon Tate murder within an hour. See it here: http://bit.ly/dB3gBP

I stand corrected.

I should have said “This guy’s obviously QUALIFIED a troll, who if he actually has the training and certs he claims would actually be able to offer substantive argument to persuade in addressing my points… rather than engage in a snipe.

As I said. A Troll. Possibly qualified, but unwilling to speak to the points. I’d ignore him at this point.

Sometimes it is better to be thought a fool than to open one’s mouth and remove all doubt.

-dcm

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The evil in … me.

Okay.

I guess we’re done then. You are so far out from reality that talking to you is an exercise in futility.

Tata.

Where did I say that?

I think if you look over my general posting habits, you will see that I have pretty much withdrawn my support of Obama.

The problem with arguing in forums like this is that everyone is so intensely focused on their own opinions that it is impossible to disagree with them even slightly without being vilified. I mostly agree with the growing anti-Obama sentiment. The fact that I look to the original source of the problems in this country does not undermine the fact that I disagree with Obama for continuing them. I do not deserve to be treated as evil simply because I don’t march in lock-step with the radicals in this forum. This sort of arrogance diminishes you and your message. It is what initially turned me off of the Republican Party (before I even knew anything about their ideology.)

With your one dred eye, you’ve a unique point of view.

I wasn’t ignoring your question, I simply forgot to answer.

The value of any education is that it may not be taken from one. I enjoyed the education, without enjoying the fruits thereof. The absolute value of an education is being able to deny it in the presence of PolPot or any of his successors like teabeggars, teabraggers or republican’ts and recover it to defeat them.

I still think O’Bama is a better option than any other on on display. Kucinich isn’t competitive and there isn’t a republican’t this side of the horizon with the intellect and balls to solve a problem.

What’s a troll?
.

Well said. So far the only intelligent disagreement about O’Bama. Keep feet toward the fire.

There are no ‘decrees’. Signing statements are unconstitutional and Executive Orders are – for the most part – public statements about enabling legislation or managing the Executive Branch. And … yes shrub & reagan, nixon et al abused it.

Yes, what you do is evil. Barack Obama is responsible for torture, etc. Anybody who says otherwise is defending torture. That’s evil. There’s no other side to that coin.

Why not? It’s overwhelmingly likely that he’s innocent – and even if he isn’t, he was repelling an illegal invasion!

This is ridiculous. I can’t believe they allowed such treatment let alone used a confession obtained through such means. It’s inexcusable. Besides that, there shouldn’t even be a trial. He should be a Prisoner of War like any other soldier. Since his attacks on us were of a military nature (if it happened at all), he should not be treated like a criminal. We would expect the same of other countries. It seems chivalry is finally on it’s deathbed.

[...] US Judge OKs confession extracted by threatening suspect with rape http://rawstory.com/rs/2010/0811/15yearold-gitmo-detainee-threatened/ [...]

Torture is illegal, but they do it. Confessions by torture are inadmissible, but they admit it anyway. There is a great article on ilogicbomb about this.

http://www.ilogicbomb.com/topic/11/Should+confessions+obtained+by+torture+be+admissible+in+US+courts%3F

Pipes is an expert on Islamic culture and fluent in various Arabic dialects. Before you condemn the truth try reading about Pipes–his educational qualities, his academic abilities and his desire and understanding for the Islamic religion to separate from Jihad like behaviour and rhetoric. He has learned and lived among the people.

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Can’t seem to change information.
SB

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