Self-described "dirty trickster" Roger Stone was outed in a recording from a Mar-a-Lago event, and a former Justice Department official pointed out some flaws in his logic.
In the tape, Stone reveals that he has the personal number of judges that he can use to protest election results in 2024.
"At least this time when they do it, you have a lawyer and a judge — his home phone number standing by — so you can stop it," Stone said of the plot. "We made no preparations last time, none … There are technical, legal steps that we have to take to try and have a more honest election. We're not there yet, but there's things that can be done."
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Addressing the tape, liberal journalist Lauren Windsor and Andrew Weissmann, former top protector for special counsel Robert Mueller, walked through potential problems with Stone's statement.
"First, let's remind people that Roger Stone, leaving aside his story of a, sort of, 'gamesmanship' in terms of how he helps political candidates, leave all of that aside," Weissmann began.
What was important to remember, he said, is that Roger Stone "went to trial and was convicted of multiple felonies by a jury beyond a reasonable doubt."
It's important to take Stone's comments with that in mind because, he said, "facts matter," particularly in a court of law."
"The reason that he was convicted is because facts were presented that proved all the felonies he was charged with beyond a reasonable doubt," said Weissmann.
Stone claimed in the tape at one point that the only reason Trump was being prosecuted was "to delay things" for political purposes, which Weissmann said made no sense because jurors found Trump guilty.
"If Donald Trump wanted to show this was all a witch hunt, he could go to trial," he added, saying there were more than 60 lawsuits about the election and he lost them — even before his own appointed judges.
He was most disturbed by Stone's claim that he has access to judges personally "this time around."
"You don't know how much is bluster, and how much is not," Weissmann explained, noting the U.S. Marshals, who protect judges, might be interested in Stone's statement.
"The fact that he is even speaking for Donald Trump speaking volumes," he continued. "I mean, he is a convicted felon, and he shouldn't be in that position."
He was speaking of Stone in that instance, not Trump, who is also a convicted felon.
Former Rep. Liz Cheney (R-WY) said that for all the problems in higher courts, the lower courts and state courts are the ones that have held against Trump's efforts.
"So, that is really the last frontier," Weissmann said of the courts. "Of course, if Roger Stone is planning on having legitimate claims in court and seeking to do this through the court process and not through attacks on the Capitol, that's how our system works. There's nothing wrong with that."
He warned, however, "We are putting a lot of eggs in the basket of the good faith and the oaths of office of judicial officers."
Windsor agreed about the concern over the judges.
She sounded the alarm that, from her tapes of Justice Samuel Alito, she fears there is a plot for him and Clarence Thomas to retire if Donald Trump is elected. This would cement the far-right radicalism that he has brought to the court for another generation.
See the full discussion in the video below or at the link here.