Trump aides who lied to Congress may not avoid jail — even if Bill Barr gives them a pass: ex-prosecutor

On MSNBC's "AM Joy," former U.S. Attorney Joyce Vance explained why impeachment witnesses like E.U. Ambassador Gordon Sondland, who changed his story frequently and was accused of perjury, could be on the hook for criminal prosecution even if Attorney General William Barr tries to help them avoid penalties.

"Lying to Congress is a crime, right?" said anchor Joy Reid. "If [Sondland] went in there and wasn't honest, couldn't he be charged with a crime? Not that we necessarily trust that William Barr's Justice Department would do anything about it."

"Right. Absolutely. He could if he committed perjury," said Vance, who previously headed up the U.S. Attorney's Office for the Northern District of Alabama, although she cautioned, "you have to have very clear evidence, and Sondland almost set himself up to have an imperfect memory defense here, saying he wasn't permitted access to his records."

"Something that they need to remember is, whatever William Barr's Justice Department is up to, the statute of limitations runs for five years," added Vance. "They are gambling on whether there might be a different Justice Department after elections in 2020, and whether or not people who deliberately surrounded Trump with a cover-up, whether they might not be finally be facing justice."

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