'It's the real thing': Historian reluctant to label Trump a fascist changes his mind

Historian Robert Paxton in the past expressed reluctance to label former President Donald Trump and his movement as fascists, while at the same time acknowledging similarities between the two.

In an interview with the New York Times, however, he explains in detail why he's changed his mind and why he believes Trump-like movements pose a danger to democracy and stability all over the globe.

"It’s bubbling up from below in very worrisome ways, and that’s very much like the original fascisms,” Paxton said. “It’s the real thing. It really is.”

The turning point for Paxton's judgement was the January 6th riots at the United States Capitol, which he says reminded him of far-right putsches in the 1930s.

However, although Paxton believes the Trump movement is fascist, he believes that the term at this point has become so loaded that it "generates more heat than light" in persuading voters about the dangers Trump represents.

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That said, he argued that the Trump movement isn't being generated specifically by the former president himself but is rather coming "from below as a mass phenomenon, and the leaders are running to keep ahead of it," which he noted was the same thing that happened with fascist movements in Italy and Germany.

The Times adds that Paxton's most groundbreaking work was on the Vichy regime in France that was actually supported by much of the public despite the fact that it had come to power through the Nazi invasion.

As Paxton tells the Times, French claims that the majority of their population was occupied against its will by the Nazis just wasn't borne out by the historical record.

"The French popular narrative of the war had been that they’d all been resisters, even if only in their thoughts," he said. "And the archives were just packed with people clamoring, defense companies wanting to construct things for the German Army, people who wanted to have jobs, people who wanted to have social contacts.”

Paxton's remarks come as multiple former Trump officials, including former Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Mark Milley and former chief of staff John Kelly, have labeled their one-time boss a fascist.