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'What?' Nicolle Wallace cracks up as Trump brags about 'terrific criminals'
May 28, 2025 5:41PM ET
MSNBC's Nicolle Wallace was shocked not only by seeing the full list of President Donald Trump's latest rounds of pardons, but also by a call he had with the daughter of one of those pardoned individuals.
On the phone with Savannah Chrisley, Trump said her jailed parents, Todd and Julie Chrisley, are "terrific people" — despite being convicted of a bank and tax fraud scheme.
"Over the course of a decade, the defendants defrauded banks out of tens of millions of dollars while evading payment of their federal income taxes," said U.S. Attorney Ryan K. Buchanan in a Justice Department release in 2022. “Their lengthy sentences reflect the magnitude of their criminal scheme and should serve as a warning to others tempted to exploit our nation’s community banking system for unlawful personal gain."
Speaking to a panel of legal experts on Wednesday, Wallace whooped with laughter as she exclaimed, "What?"
She momentarily fumbled her words.
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"They're terrific criminals! What? I mean, what, what, what are we doing here, Harry Litman?" she asked.
Litman, a former federal prosecutor and legal analyst, attacked Trump's pardon as "deeply repugnant."
"The power that he has may be broad, but it's supposed to be in support of social values, of mercy and forgiveness for people who admit the crimes they do and then make a better life," Litman said. "It's exactly not what this is supposed to be. And the [Paul] Walczak [pardon] case, I think, is a crime. It's just that the Supreme Court has ruled he can't be prosecuted. But it sure looks like not just extortion, but a flat-out bribe."
Walczak was found guilty by a jury of bribery and ordered to pay $4 million in restitution for tax crimes. His mother, Elizabeth Fago donated $1 million to Trump at a Mar-a-Lago fundraiser.
"It's supposed to be part and parcel of the criminal justice system. Instead, he's using it as an override for the most crass, most political, least sort of public-spirited reasons there are."
There were an additional five pardons added to the report of those Trump signed recently that had already been announced. Litman said he didn't know anything about them, but guaranteed that they likely supported Trump's 2024 campaign.
"And that really should always be irrelevant to a pardon application," he added.
See the clip below or at the link here.
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