Trump's 'scheme' is 'bigger than we imagined’ -- and here's exactly what's going to 'bring down' the president

MSNBC's "Up with David Gura" on Saturday analyzed President Donald Trump's "horrible very bad no good day" after federal prosecutors in the Southern District of New York publicly accused him of committing felonies as an unindicted co-conspirator in the case of Michael Cohen, his longtime "fixer" and lawyer.

"What changed yesterday?" Gura asked Mimi Rocah, the former chief of the Organized Crime and Racketeering Unit in the Southern District of New York. "How pivotal was it?"

"I think it was very pivotal," Rocah replied.

"And while it's not spelled out, I think what's coming to light more and more is that those business deals that Cohen lied about -- and I'll talk about maybe others who might have lied about it in a second -- are so intertwined with this campaign, collusion, election interference that we've all been focused on," she explained.

Rocah reminded that special counsel Robert Mueller knows far more than has been publicly reported or revealed in legal filings.

"What's starting to take shape, I think, is a narrative, if you will, that Mueller has long known, but I think we're just starting to see it," she argued. "But it's this idea of the business and the political intertwining and that is ultimately I think what is going to bring down Trump, frankly."

"Because it is the greediness, it is the inability to let go, to seek these business opportunities in Moscow," she explained. "It's this long standing relationship that we now know went back to 2015 when Russians were seeking out talking to Trump about, we think, business opportunities and probably a campaign."

"So I think this is in some ways bigger than any of us had imagined in items of the scheme that was orchestrated," Rocah suggested.

She also highlighted the "coordination of the lies."

"You have this idea of people sending signals or getting their stories straight both publicly and privately," she noted. "And you know who else does that is Donald Trump."

"So a lot of what was written about Cohen in both filings could have been written about Trump, I think, about trying to get messages out to other potential witnesses and make sure everybody had their stories straight," she concluded.

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