'You want me to lie?' RFK melts down as senator confronts him during combative hearing
Health and Human Services Secretary Robert F. Kennedy Jr. visibly lost his temper during a Senate hearing as Sen. Chris Murphy (D-CT) confronted him with promises he made to respect public health and not interfere in vaccine approval during his confirmation hearing, only to change his tune the second he got into office.
Kennedy, who heads up Trump's so-called "Make America Healthy Again" agenda, is an anti-vaccine conspiracy theorist who has falsely linked vaccines to autism and promised to defer to experts to win over a handful of skeptical Republicans, including Sen. Bill Cassidy (R-LA), a physician.
"You canceled $12 billion in grants to the states, including my state, that are used to administer and track vaccines," said Murphy. "You promised Chairman Cassidy—"
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"I'd like to—" blurted out Kennedy, as Murphy called for order to continue his line of questioning. "When did I do that?"
"Let me finish my question," said Murphy.
"You made an accusation. Just tell me when I did it so I can understand what the question is," said Kennedy.
"You've canceled, you have canceled $12 billion in public health grants to states, whether you know this or not," said Murphy. "That funding is used by the states, in part, to be able to administer and dispense information about vaccines."
"Which program?" said Kennedy.
"Mr. Secretary, let me, let me give you the full panoply of things you've said before this committee that didn't turn out to be true," said Murphy. "You also promised Chairman Cassidy that the FDA would not change vaccine standards from, quote, 'historical norms.' But what happened as soon as you were sworn in? You announced new standards for vaccine approvals that you proudly referred to in your own press release as a 'radical departure from current practice,' and experts say that departure will delay approvals. You also said, specific to the measles vaccine, that you support the measles vaccine. But you have consistently been undermining the measles vaccine. You told the public that the vaccine wanes very quickly, you went on the Dr. Phil Show and said that the measles vaccine was never fully tested for safety. You said there's fetal debris in the measles vaccine—"
"All true!" blurted out Kennedy. "All true. You want me to lie to the public?"
"None of that is true," said Murphy.
"Of course it's true!" said Kennedy. "Senator, begging your pardon, you don't know what you're talking about."
"Madam Chair, I'm speaking," said Murphy, addressing the committee leadership. "I didn't ask for a response yet. I'd like to lay out the predicate of my question before I'm interrupted by the witness. He should have some respect for this committee."
Murphy then continued. "Just this morning in front of the House of Representatives, you also said that you, in fact, would not recommend that kids get vaccinated for measles, you said you would just lay out the pros and cons. So this summation of everything that you have said to compromise people's faith in the measles vaccine, in particular, is contrary to what you said to this committee. You said you'd support the measles vaccine, but then you have laid out a set of facts that are contested, and I will submit information for the record from experts who contest what you've said about the vaccine. And the result is to undermine faith in the vaccines."
Kennedy's rhetoric around vaccines, Murphy added, is "kind of like saying, listen, I think you should swim in that lake, but, you know, the lake is probably toxic and there's probably a ton of snakes and alligators in that lake, but I think you should swim in it."