Ex-senator says Rudy Giuliani is inches from turning on Trump given news of new agreement

Rudy Giuliani has been invited to speak to special counsel Jack Smith more than once, according to multiple reports. One was about the shouting match inside the Oval Office about seizing voting machines and other arguments.

Speaking to former prosecutor and former Democratic Sen. Claire McCaskill (MO) and legal analyst and former prosecutor Harry Litman, MSNBC substitute host Ayman Mohyeldin asked how much trouble Rudy Giuliani might be in given campaign finance schemes.

McCaskill explained that it was recently revealed that Giuliani is meeting with Smith under a "cooperation agreement." She referred to that deal under the legal word: a "proffer."

"If you're making a proffer, in the federal system, that is a precursor to an agreement to cooperate with the prosecution and turn into a witness against targeted individuals," she said. "This is a big deal because Giuliani was in the federal system. He knows what a proffer means. And if 'proffer' means in this instance that Giuliani is willing to say what really happened, and testify against Donald Trump, in order to save his own skin."

McCaskill also said that it's something that should cause concern for the former president.

"I will beat this drum again: the only thing that bugs me about this proffer is it is occurring in June of 2023. Everyone knew Giuliani was at the center of this mess. Way back in Feb. and March of 2021. Why did it take this long for DOJ to get to the heart of the matter and that is trying to turn Giuliani as a witness?"

Litman agreed, saying that it's an example of Giuliani "scurrying" and thinking "I'm in real trouble now."

"I think that is the short answer," Litman continued. "We don't know if there were overtures made before, but if there were, he resisted them. Now he realizes, 'Gulp, I'm in trouble.' And his lateness might count against him. They might not need him anymore. They might say thanks, but no thanks. We heard your evidence, and we could get it from someone else who decided to cooperate like the elections coordinator had. So he's going in saying please, but he may be too late to the table."

Dennis Aftergut previously wrote for the Bulwark that Giuliani "has every incentive to spill his guts." It comes amid reports that Trump's own lawyers are the ones who have been among the best witnesses for the investigation.

See the conversation in the video below or at the link.

- YouTubewww.youtube.com