Which is exactly what Giuliani did on Aug. 23 following the conclusion of the Democratic National Convention in Chicago, where Vice President Kamala Harris accepted her party's presidential nomination.
Speaking on his show “America’s Mayor Live,” Giuliani introduced the 10-minute segment with Rachel Siegel, a woman who drew attention during the previous week for her racist actions, Hitler salutes and antisemitic protests outside the Democratic National Convention.
Giuliani said on his show that Siegel was 21 years old, suggesting that her youth gave her a unique perspective.
“Therefore, what we thought was we would ask Rachel her view of what’s going on in Chicago and in the United States, particularly with the influence now of this convention,” Giuliani said.
Siegel described herself in the interview as a “lifelong hardcore conservative.”
But four days earlier, in an interview with video journalist Ford Fischer at Chicago’s Union Park — where pro-Palestine protesters gathered to protest the DNC — Siegel had used another word to describe herself: “Fascist.”
Among a dozen or so far-right extremists who sought to infiltrate or otherwise exploit the pro-Palestine protests to promote their own agenda during the week of the convention, Siegel stood out.
On Aug. 19, the first day of the convention, Raw Story observed Siegel holding up a hand-written cardboard sign at Union Square that was replete with slogans attacking Jews, Black people and LGBTQ+ people.
Siegel’s sign read: “F--- n-----s. Go the f--- back to the s---hole you’re from. Jews f--- off. F-----s eat s---. Get AIDS and die!’”
Siegel’s sign also included a hand-drawn swastika.
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The following day, Raw Story observed Siegel and another woman holding a banner outside the Israeli consulate in Chicago that promoted the white supremacist conspiracy theory known as the Great Replacement. The banner included the Telegram channel for a white supremacist group.
At least twice that night, Siegel was observed giving straight-arm Hitler salutes, one of which Raw Story witnessed in person.
Siegel’s racist and antisemitic actions were the subject of an article published by Raw Story on Aug. 22.
Ted Goodman, Giuliani’s publicist and spokesman, did not respond on the record to an inquiry from Raw Story about Giuliani’s decision to bring Siegel on the show.
But a video published on X by the @satireAP account shows Goodman walking over to Siegel after dozens of pro-Palestine protesters had been arrested near the Israeli consulate on Aug. 20. The owner of the @satireAP account can be heard in the video mocking Giuliani as “RICO Rudy” while calling Goodman “Nurse Boy.”
“Go hang out with the Nazis, Nurse Boy,” the @satireAP account owner says. “She’s a Nazi. Go get her. Go get her. Follow her. That’s just your type right there.”
The video then shows Goodman and Siegel huddling.
Siegel pulls out her phone as Goodman speaks, and she appears to punch in his number.
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“Did you not see her videos today, Nurse Boy?” the @satireAP account owner says. “Oh, you’re going to be in so much trouble. This is bad. This is a bad look. I’m gonna have the shot. Exchanging contact info with the Nazi…. Bro, you just gave your phone number.”
“That’s a bad look,” the @satireAP account owner continues, speaking directly to Goodman. “Did you see her videos from today?”
“Who is that?” Goodman asks.
“You should have found out before you exchanged info with her,” the @satireAP account owner says. “That’s so bad. She is viral like crazy today here. She’s a literal Nazi, bro. She has the worst racist Nazi sign.”
Goodman ignores the @satireAP account owner, a livestreamer known for trolling Trump associates involved in the effort to overturn the 2020 election.
Goodman turns his camera toward the protesters, and says, “I got friends! All right, guys. Guys! What is going on? Look at these guys.”
That was three days before Siegel appeared on Giuliani’s show.
‘You are not colonized; you are conquered’
Siegel altered her message from the time she was protesting in Chicago’s streets to her appearance on Giuliani’s show.
Instead of holding a sign that read “F— off Jews” as she did earlier last week, she told Giuliani that she believes the treatment of the Jews by Hamas is “abhorrent.”
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“If anyone who is an American citizen thinks it is acceptable for a terrorist cell to invade a sovereign recognized nation with its own military, its own set of laws that has existed for decades, and say, ‘Well, we were here first.’ Are you 6 years old?” Siegel told Giuliani. “‘We were here first.’ You were not colonized; you were conquered. When a stronger society or civilization comes into an area, you are not colonized; you are conquered.”
Siegel’s rhetoric echoes Patriot Front, one of the most active white supremacist groups in the United States, which uses the slogan “Not Stolen. Conquered” to describe the relationship between people of European descent and the land of North America.
Siegel also used her appearance on Giuliani’s show to convey a watered-down version of the message on the banner she displayed during the protest outside the Israeli consulate on Aug. 20, the night she exchanged contact information with Goodman.
The banner stated, “Stop the white replacement. Deport them all.”
Siegel emphasized to Giuliani that she is an American citizen and her family members were born in the United States.
“I’m very proud to live here. I would never want to live anywhere else,” Siegel said. “And I feel very much to my core that people who are not grateful to live in this country should leave. If you are not happy, you go to Palestine.”
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Giuliani appeared to be charmed by Siegel, laughing at least twice in response to her remarks.
At one point, following a rant in which Siegel called her progressive contemporaries “hyper-opinionated” and “mentally ill,” Giuliani paused a moment, as if to take it all in, and then blurted out: “I think you’re absolutely right!”
Following Siegel’s guest appearance, one of her followers on X gave her credit for adapting her message to Giuliani’s more mainstream MAGA audience.
“I didn’t hear anything objectionable,” the X user commented. “Not really shilling for Israel. She did a good job considering the audience.”
“I would never!” Siegel replied, adding a smiley face.
Giuliani described himself on the YouTube show as “a very, very strong emotional supporter of Israel.”
Common ground on racist stereotypes about immigrants
It’s been a year for Giuliani.
A very bad year.
Last August, Giuliani was criminally charged in Georgia — alongside former president and current Republican nominee Donald Trump and 16 others — with racketeering and other alleged offenses to overturn the election.
Three months later, a federal jury found Giuliani liable for $148 million in a defamation lawsuit brought by two Black election workers in Georgia.
And last month, he was disbarred in his home state of New York for repeatedly lying about the 2020 election.
The conduct at the heart of the defamation case against Giuliani involves characterizations that play on stereotypes of Black criminality that are deeply rooted in American society.
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During a Dec. 10, 2020, hearing at the Georgia state legislature, Giuliani called attention to “two people” — a mother and daughter who were Black election workers — who he falsely accused of passing USB thumb drives containing manipulated election data “as if they’re vials of heroin and cocaine. I mean, it’s obvious to anyone who is a criminal investigator or prosecutor, they’re engaged in surreptitious illegal activity.”
Following Giuliani’s remarks, the women faced a deluge of racist threats. State investigators found that they engaged in no wrongdoing. And the incident Giuliani described as “surreptitious illegal activity” was nothing more than the two women exchanging a mint.
Prior to Siegel’s appearance on his show, Giuliani played a video clip showing protesters burning an American flag outside the Israeli consulate. He used the clip as a jumping-off point to convey a negative and false — in short, racist — characterization of Palestinian people.
“Don’t go soft on me on Palestinians or we’re going to have a terrible problem here,” Giuliani said. “Palestinians are taught to kill you at 2 years old. They’re taught to kill Jews. They’re taught to kill Americans.”
Noting that Israel’s neighbors have closed their borders to Palestinians seeking to escape Gaza and the West Bank, Giuliani continued: “But we’re supposed to take them. Is there a reason for this? We don’t have enough murder?”
Siegel expressed a similar view — also echoing Trump’s rhetoric — by falsely equating immigrants and refugees with criminality and violence.
“We are living in a death spiral in this nation,” she said. “We have an immigration problem that is murdering children, raping children, and there is no hold on it. There is no gauge on it. We have no idea how many of these individuals are even in our nation.”
During Siegel’s segment, Goodman, Giuliani’s publicist, can be heard speaking off camera as Giuliani asks him to adjust the shot.
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Later, Goodman joined the show as Giuliani lamented that his mayoral legacy has been erased. Giuliani also complained about the cost of housing migrants in New York City.
“It makes me feel exceedingly sad to the point of every once in a while wanting to cry,” Giuliani said.
Giuliani recalled that he recently told a supporter that “the only thing they haven’t ruined is the hope,” adding that someday in the future a leader might come along and pick up where he left off.
“There are men in this country’s history that cannot be replaced, and you are one of them,” Goodman replied.
One person who has not forgotten Giuliani: Trump.
In May, Trump recorded a video greeting that was played at an Italian restaurant in Manhattan where Giuliani was celebrating his 80th birthday.
“You’re a very special guy, Rudy,” Trump reportedly said to the man who for years served as his personal attorney. “Just keep fighting. There’s nobody like you.”
Last September, Trump hosted a fundraiser at his Bedminster, N.J., golf club to help Giuliani cover his legal bills.
Giuliani also still enjoys elevated standing at five colleges that — unlike several others — have declined to rescind honorary degrees they bestowed on Giuliani prior to his current legal troubles.
The schools include Georgetown University in Washington, D.C.; Syracuse University in Syracuse, N.Y.; The Citadel in Charleston, S.C.; St. John Fisher University in Pittsford, N.Y.; and Loyola University Maryland in Baltimore, Md.
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