On Tuesday, Michael Wolff, the author of the White House exposé Fire and Fury, told CNN's John Berman that he believes President Donald Trump's former campaign chairman and presidential strategist Steve Bannon is privy to the crimes he has committed through his family business — and to his obstruction of justice against the Russia investigation.
"You wrote a great deal about Steve Bannon," said Berman. "He is your main avenue, it's fair to say?"
"I call him my Virgil lesson, as in a descent into hell," said Wolff, noting that the two of them are still very close and have a complicated relationship, even after he left the White House.
"I want to ask you. It is fascinating," said Berman. "This gets to the idea of the investigations into the Trump businesses. There was a suggestion that the president's personal company is a 'semi-criminal enterprise,' and Bannon responded to you, 'I think we could drop the semi part.' So was he joking, or what do you think he meant there?"
"I think that he's, he's perfectly straightforward about this," said Wolff. "And he's perfectly straightforward about, I think, the way that most people who have been around Donald Trump believe. They believe that, you know, Donald Trump's long career has been a, well, I would say, semi-criminal career. Steve Bannon would say, lose the semi."
"So does he have direct knowledge of that, do you think, or just suspect it at this point?" Berman pressed him.
"Yeah, I suspect he does have direct knowledge of that," replied Wolff.
"Do you think Steve Bannon believes that the president obstructed justice?" said Berman.
"Yes," said Wolff. "Now I would say that Steve Bannon would go and characterize this as, that's Donald Trump. So, I mean, the Steve Bannon view is partly, you know what this guy is, there's never been any, any illusion otherwise. He's Donald Trump. That's the man you elected. A man who cannot, literally cannot, tell the truth."